Re: Selling personal data -- an experiment

Lubna Dajani

As usual I agree with Susan. 

We must re-examine the framing; step out of the context of today’s failed models where personal data is being used and abused for the sake of short term profits and think of what and how it is that we will actually (technically and in practice) establish new framing rather than bandaids and workarounds reenforcing the same framing and foundation which we know will leading down a misguided path.

Let’s  ask ourselves how do we enable individuals (person or entities) to be transparently, anonymously and “fairly” compensated for the value of their data that they chose to make available for exchange in the market place, free from considerations of how it is done today?

Can we step back from today’s models?   

The use case discussed here about marketing products to targeted individuals using their data to manipulate their behavior to further feed a false need and desire to over consume and waste so we can sell more faster, all for the economic benefit of shareholders at all coasts to environment and  other stakeholders. 

How can we begin to frame a new way and rational for exchange and commerce? 

In the marketing/advertising example used in the trail suggests that the current models will remain and I don’t believe we or the planet can afford to continue enabling consumerism and the ways of today. 

I believe it’s our obligation at technologist and thought leaders to envisage and establish a new way of sharing and exchanging that have regenerative and functional basis. We know each and every individual has a unique value to offer in this life and we need to think about what we can do to facilitate meaningful exchange.  

I also wonder about our labels and all that comes with them. If I am making my data (Anonymously or otherwise) available for a value then am I not the seller/vendor in this case? And if I am the buyer/consumer be it of data or product/service could it be that we describe what we seek and have that matched to the available products that fit (be the product a car a meal or a data set?)

Could we not level this out so that we creat products they meet the demand rather than using technology and science to manipulate behavior to create artificial demand for needless consumption and waste just to generate short term revenue for “shareholders” at any cost to stakeholders and the planet?
Pardon me the rant 🖖

, so please forgive any typos or autocorrect fumbles 
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On Jul 25, 2020, at 12:37 PM, susan morrow <susan.morrow@...> wrote:

Good luck Milton

On Sat, Jul 25, 2020 at 11:33 AM Milton Pedraza <mpedraza@...> wrote:
It’s not a commodity, it’s a precious resource and the representation of a human life that can be a force for good. That’s the point. Human life and dignity are being devalued as a commodity right now by platforms. And we need to create representation and fair treatment and value for all human beings. The Mes need to be ethically and fairly represented in an asymmetrical digital world where data is the greatest resource. I agree with some that depending on its use, such as finding a cure, data can have high value. Those whose data was used should be fairly compensated. It’s complex, but like poverty and racism, the status quo must be changed. No perfect answers but a positive direction. 

Milton Pedraza
Luxury Institute, LLC

On Jul 25, 2020, at 4:51 AM, susan morrow <susiemorrow@...> wrote:

And switching it around to the actual human part of the transaction...

I am a woman with a 3-month old baby and nowhere to live. I am sofa surfing to keep my baby from living on the streets. I use a friend's computers but I still have online accounts because I wasn't always homeless and won't always be so (although I don't know that at the time) - so I do have digital data to sell. I go online using a friend's computer and see that I can now sell my data. Bloody great because I am totally skint and my baby needs a warm coat for the winter. I sell to whoever and however because I do not have the luxury of choice and consent is a joke when there is no choice.

You are creating a dystopian stick to hit people without choice if you make personal data a commodity - I don't like nanny states but this is not about that. If we were working in health or science we'd have to have an ethical framework to work off. Technologists don't seem to care coz it's about the money.

I am going back to my cave.

On Fri, Jul 24, 2020 at 11:51 PM Johannes Ernst <jernst@...> wrote:
To shed some light about the viability of selling personal data, on a non-trivial scale, by “consumers" to one or more “vendors" — which I think is the scenario being discussed — I suggest a thought experiment.

Let’s say I am willing to sell my personal data (I’m not, but let’s assume I am), any of it, as long as the price is right.

For the purposes of this experiment, let’s also assume that there are no technical hurdles that make this impractical — all relevant data exists in electronic form, is standardized, easily shareable etc.

You are the “vendor” who wants to buy some of that personal data from me:

* Who are you? (Industry, product, …)
* What data do you want to buy from me?
* How is receiving that data from me materially going to improve your business?
* How is buying that data from me better for you than the alternatives? (e.g. asking nicely :-))
* How are you avoiding being gamed?

I’d love to hear some compelling stories. Because so far I haven’t heard any :-)



Johannes Ernst

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Susan Morrow
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